Lesson 3 of 18ViolinIntermediate

Time Signatures

5:47

Chris Haigh introduces the odd time signatures that drive prog rock - starting with 5/4 and 7/8 - and how to feel and play them on violin.

© 2011 Schott Music Ltd, London

Part of the courseRock Violin Styles & Performance18 lessons (1h 41m)

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Chris HaighYour guruChris Haigh

What's in the course

18 lessons (1h 41m) · 1 free
    • 01. Prog Rock

      Free lesson

      2:41

    • 02. Antonio (Performance)

      1:19

    • 03. Time Signatures

      You are here

      5:47

    • 04. Revelations 15 (Performance)

      2:24

Lesson transcript

Exploring Odd Time Signatures in Prog Rock

One of the most exciting things about prog rock is the common use of odd time signatures. I first discovered this probably when I was around 17.

If you don't know what a time signature is, especially the more complicated ones, it can sound completely baffling. This is because the straightforward rock rhythm is absent, replaced by strange, jumping rhythms.

Incidentally, Bulgarian folk music is packed with these odd signatures, primarily played by peasants for dancing. It's quite interesting, and amusing, that such rhythms have also made their way into the repertoire of intellectual, so-called prog rock players.

A Historical Perspective

I believe this concept found its way into Western popular music through Dave Brubeck, who wrote pieces like Take Five. His jazz standards, written in odd time signatures, encourage listeners to think, "Yes, this is interesting."

Understanding these rhythms can be quite challenging but ultimately rewarding.

Starting with 5/4

Let's consider 5/4 time for a start. You might have a phrase like:

  • 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

This can be played as:

  • 1, 2, 3, 4, .5 again.

You can split it up in various ways, such as:

  • 1, 2, 3, 1, 2
  • 1, 2, 1, 2, 3
  • Or a mixture of these.

By getting the rhythm into your head, you can create many different variations without rigidly sticking to the same pattern.

Example Melody in 5/4

Here's a little melody in 5/4 time.

  • It might take you a while to get your head around playing that melody.
  • It might take you even longer to improvise, but it is certainly possible!

A Solo Example

Here's an example of a little solo over that 5/4 sequence.

Moving to 7/8 Time

Now, let's explore a tune in 7/8 time. What we have here is:

  • 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1
  • 2, 3, 1, 2, 1, 2.

The key to understanding these time signatures is in identifying those threes and twos.

Counting Challenges

Most non-Bulgarian musicians (like myself) count in 1, 2, 3, 4 and then shift to whatever time signature they are trying to play. This is something I find incredibly challenging, getting my head around how to count logically into these tunes.

Personal Experience

I have spent considerable time in 7/8, largely because, apart from playing prog rock, I also engage with a lot of Bulgarian music. I'm going to demonstrate a little improvisation on that sequence.

If you're willing to dedicate the necessary hundreds or thousands of hours to mastering this, it becomes a very exciting skill to develop.

Conclusion: The Most Pretentious Tune

To finish this lesson, I'll present possibly the most pretentious tune I've ever written. It's called Revelations 15, and it utilizes both 15/8 time and 7/8 time.

When we recorded this in the studio, tensions ran high, we almost came to blows! Thankfully, the sound engineer heroically managed to fix the mistakes we made.

While this isn't an easy tune, it can be quite fun to play. If you listen to Genesis' "Firth of Fifth," you'll get an idea of the kind of inspiration for this composition.

Your Assignment

For your assignment this lesson:

  • Forget about your medical degree that was going to take you seven years.
  • Instead, practice Revelations 15! You'll thank me in the long run.

Better still, try improvising your own solo. That will take you another five years!

Before starting any of these tasks, make sure to listen to Genesis' "Firth of Fifth" and see if you can identify the 15/8 section.

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Meet your guru

Chris Haigh

Chris Haigh

Chris Haigh has been a professional fiddle player for 25 years, with experience covering many different genres. He has played on over 75 albums, working with artists including Alison Moyet, Bob Geldof, All About Eve, Michael Ball, David Soul, Oumou Sangare, The Quireboys, Riverdance, Morcheeba, James Galway and Steps.

He has played swing jazz with The Kimbara Brothers, Diz Disley, Le Jazz, The Hot Club of London, and the Quecumbar Allstars, and leads a 7-piece Soviet swing band, The Kremlinaires.

Chris gives lessons and workshops on jazz violin technique and has taught jazz violin at Middlesex, Brunel and Newcastle universities and Truro College. His writing credits include nine fiddle books, among them The Fiddle Handbook.

He also runs Fiddling Around (fiddlingaround.co.uk), probably the most comprehensive and widely visited source of fiddle information on the web.

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